My advice to Graf...

[Soultaker]

I thougt I would give out some good advice to Graf. I have noticed that you Graf have been bitching and moaning about Randy being so slow well please be aware that it is only gonna slow you and the development of GZDooM down if you let Randy and his problems get to you. As pretty much anyone knows Skull Tag is at a pretty powerful state because Carn never allowed Randy and his problems to get in his way. If you allow another mans actions to slow you down then that will cause sever problems for you and GZDooM. I would rather see you Graf forget about Randy and just keep on chugging. I do not care if GZDooM turns out completly different from ZDooM as long as it is still fun to use and run. Skull Tag looks nothing like ZDooM except for a few lingering but much needed bits and pieces. GZDooM should be the same way. I feel if GZDooM keeps relying on Randy and ZDooM then it will feel like ZDooM. I will admit I want a GZDooM that does not look, act or feel like ZDooM but instead looks, acts and feels like a modrn day port that can kick ass, take names and blow the competition out of the water. Hell look at DooMs Day and Risen3D. I see no difference between either port because the guy behind Risen3D did not do much to really make it feel different from DooMs Day which it is based off of.

[Graf Zahl]

My big problem with Randy is that his upcoming update is so massive that it affects all the code I am writing. Much of what I am doing right now has to be rewritten once I get a stable floating point version of ZDoom.

There's a lot of stuff where I'd have to re-invent it from scratch but that is a futile attempt considering that all of the code has to be adjusted to a completely different underlying data rather soon. Under such circumstances I will most certainly not invest too much work into something obsolete.

If this was a 'norma' update with normal gameplay feature enhancements I wouldn't have these problems.

To compensate my focus right now is on stuff that isn't too much affected by the internal change of data format. But much of that doesn't offer too much to the game's user.

Last but not least, I really don't see much of a point to deviate too much from ZDoom. I'd rather share my ideas than create something incompatible.

[Nash]

Will GZDoom (or whatever it shall be named later) eventually become a totally unique port that has nothing to do with ZDoom, after all the floating point code is implemented? If GZDoom becomes a totally different, unique port, it will basically become a competitor for ZDoom, pretty much like any of the other Doom ports around right now.

Or will GZDoom just function as "ZDoom with OpenGL and 3-d floors"? If this is the case, timmie's ZDoomGL will be obsolete because GZDoom has everything that ZDoomGL has, minus your 3-d floor code.

Or better still, what IS your ultimate goal with GZDoom (besides the love for Doom and the fun in coding)?

[Graf Zahl]

Will GZDoom (or whatever it shall be named later) eventually become a totally unique port that has nothing to do with ZDoom, after all the floating point code is implemented? If GZDoom becomes a totally different, unique port, it will basically become a competitor for ZDoom, pretty much like any of the other Doom ports around right now.

I'll focus on the GL part. For the foreseeable future there's enough work just in there so I don't think I'll touch the game code any time soon. Much depends on Randy's way to deal with 2.0.96x's features though. The less he changes the less differences there will be. I already said that i am going to keep all of it that is possible.

Or will GZDoom just function as "ZDoom with OpenGL and 3-d floors"? If this is the case, timmie's ZDoomGL will be obsolete because GZDoom has everything that ZDoomGL has, minus your 3-d floor code.

Not yet. The shaders are missing. But I'll add them when I find some time.

Or better still, what IS your ultimate goal with GZDoom (besides the love for Doom and the fun in coding)?

'Ultimate goal'? Such things aren't good. My initial goal was to create a robust GL source port that can handle the vast majority of vanilla/ZDoom maps and I think in that regard I already succeeded. All that's left is to make it better.

[Nash]

Deep down inside, you KNOW your port will eventually be a replacement for ZDoom and ZDoomGL... admit it.

Even if it isn't a true replacement, your port will turn to be a far more superior port, what with the (currently in progress) Fragscript support, plus some Vavoom support, etc.

I mean, realistically speaking - what will happen is that you will create a port that supports all of ZDoom's fancy editing features, will feature 3-d model and shader support, PLUS your 3-d floor feature.

Any editing freak will choose your port because it offers the best of all features! The only exception would be users who don't have 3-d hardware.

[NecroMage]

I think GZDooM is gonna be port for those who want the more advanced options that ZDooM does not support. ZDooM probably will be the major port and the choice of those who cannot support the needed hardware (like me) or those who are too afraid that all this modern stuff is "undoomish" and hence sacreligion.

[Killionaire]

As necromage said, there are people (like randy) who aren't budging from ZDoom at all. If extra stuff was everybody's main attraction, ZDoomGL likely would have been a lot more popular than it was. After all, there is no comparison between the traffic of ZDoomGL and Zdoom, I just hope GZDoom doesn't fall behind like ZDoomGL, as i haven't seen updates for that place in ages.

[Graf Zahl]

If extra stuff was everybody's main attraction, ZDoomGL likely would have been a lot more popular than it was.

I think the big problem with ZDoomGL was that the development wasn't public. With a secret development forum and private beta testing you are not getting the feedback you need.
Plus, the speed issues didn't help either.

After all, there is no comparison between the traffic of ZDoomGL and Zdoom, I just hope GZDoom doesn't fall behind like ZDoomGL, as i haven't seen updates for that place in ages.

Timmie posted in the hidden forum that he'd take a break and won't update it for the foreseeable future. The public wasn't informed of this though.